DF50 2009 - pee-hole output intermittent and sometimes stops

[mike.floutier]

Hi,

I've been running my DF50 - 2009, in a big waste bin every couple of weeks, whilst my boat is out of the water for winter.

I've noticed that the output at the pee-hole is intermittent. That is to say, sometimes it's a steady stream, but it often pulses before being steady again. This cycle repeats regularly and, on rare occasions, the output stops entirely. When it stops, if it doesn't start again immediately, I stop the engine and restart it straight away; it then pees in the same way as before; intermittently.

I recently changed the impeller. This went fine and the old one looked in perfect condition.

The water temperature from the pee-hole is warm after warmup and after running for around 15 minutes, the water in the bin is also warm.

The two attached pics show water emerging from the gearbox linkage and also from a couple of holes in the back of the mid unit, just above the lower of the visible fins - now sure of this is normal.

Any ideas what's happening and how I can proceed with diagnosis and remedy?

Many thanks,

Mike



image.jpegimage.jpeg F

[Moonlighter]

Could be several things at play. All to do with the cooling system maintenance.

When you changed the impeller, did you also change the stainless housing that it fits into? If you didnt, that could be the issue. A tiny invisible imperfection in the shape of the housing can cause flow issues. We always change both at the same time.

Have you tried poking a piece of heavy mono line up the pee hole while the engine is idling? Coild be just a bit of rubbish in there that is oartially blocking it, and the mono will usually unblock it.

When was the last time you pulled the thermostat and cleaned and tested/replaced it?

You would expect the water to get warm after running in a bucket for a while because you are recirculating water thru the engine. Totally normal.

[TxAg66]

The OP mentioned "The two attached pics show water emerging from the gearbox linkage .. <rest snipped>". My question: Is water NOT supposed to dribble out from where the linkage exits from the lower leg? I've changed my impeller and the plate below it and still see a little water flowing out of the linkage exit hole. (Like the second photo above.) Problem?

[mike.floutier]

IMG_0470.PNG

Thanks for your comments guys.

This is a diagram of the cooling water circulation which I've found helpful in thinking about this.

Just to cover the areas you mentioned:

1. The impeller (water pump system) is working fine, as evidenced by the steady stream of water (that CAN occur) at the pilot (pee) hole.

2. Regarding poking mono line up the pee hole, I'll try that next time I'm at the boat but I see from the manual that the rubber pipe it connects to goes straight to a "T" junction so not sure how far I'll get but I will try it.

3. The thermostat appears to be working fine as evidenced by the warmth of the water in the bin AND the fact that I'm not getting any Overheat warnings. Incidentally. I don't feel the thermostat can be responsible for the symptoms since, as can be seen from the above diagram, the circulation from the water intake to the pee hole is way upstream of it. However, in light of your experience and the age of the unit I will remove it for testing ASAP.

4. The total "dribble" when you combine both dribbles (the two pics) PLUS another small amount leaking from the bottom of the lower engine cover is fairly significant.

TxAg66 asks if the dribble is normal. The diagram of the water cooling system is particularly helpful in this regard. It's clear that, FAILING any leaks caused by punctured pipes or poorly fitted joints etc, water should ONLY exit through a) the pee hole, b) the Prop exhaust outlet, and, in undesirable circumstances, through c) the Pressure Valve.

The implication of this is that "Dribbles" I am seeing are either output from the Pressure Valve (which may be malfunctioning; ie. opening when it shouldn't) or the output of a leak in the system.

It has been so helpful to work through this with you guys so a big thank you!

My plan now is:

1. To poke out the pee hole pipework as far as possible - and see what occurs and

2. Remove thermostat for testing.

3. Next, I will start stripping down the engine, firstly to check my impeller replacement work - never done this before.

4. Then I want to focus on the Pressure Valve. Unfortunately details of the location and servicing of the valve are described in Section 7 page 5 of the workshop manual (according to the pic above) and that section is missing from the online manual so I'm at a loss at present.

5. I also want to run the engine with the lower cover off so I can see where this third small dribble is starting from. This may help pinpointing a possible blockage.

6. Another thing I want to do is to run the engine with flushing muffs on. Not really sure what I'm expecting here but...

Anyway, that's more than enough for now, sorry to ramble on.

Will report back ASAP but, in the meantime, if any more ideas occur to anyone or if anyone knows where I can find the mysterious Chapter 7 page 5 of the manual I'd be very glad.

Many thanks! Mike

[mike.floutier]

Not sure how readable the last image was so here's a bigger one


DF50 7-5.jpg

[Hoosmatroos]

There are some holes in the lower part to drain the water if the engine shuts down and you lift it out of the water.

[Solarman]

Might be a good idea to pour a few gals of vinegar in your can to see if any buildup of salts or other corrosion matter maybe causing problems. Wouldn't hurt, might save pulling everything apart.

Good luck.

[mike.floutier]

Thanks guys, weather's looking good today so will have a visit and try out some of these ideas. To be honest I quite like the idea of pulling it apart and getting to know it.

Still a a bit frustrated that the vital section 7 of the manual is missing but seem to have located the mysterious water Pressure Valve's location on the Brownspoint.com site's Parts Lookup pages.

[Hoosmatroos]

http://www.boats.net/parts/search/Su...TAT/parts.html

There you can find it.

[Moonlighter]

You would find it here on this site’s parts section as well. It also shows you the water system arramgements reasonaly well too.

http://www.boats.net/parts/search/Su...TAT/parts.html

And while you are checking things re water flow and corrosion, make sure you check the engine internal anodes. See this link:

http://www.boats.net/parts/search/Su...EAD/parts.html

When you remove the anodes to inspect them, if you see corrosion inside the engine where they fit, then as others have said, when you get it all back together, a vinegar flush could be something to consider. Add a couple jugs of vinegar to the drum of water you are running the engine in, and run it for a while in the water/vinegar solution until the drum’s water gets warm, dont let it get very hot. Then stop and allow the water to cool, then repeat. Repeat the process a few times over the course of a day. Allow to cool. Then see how much gunk is in the bottom of the drum. You could then remove an anode again to see the difference. Finish by flushing thoroughly with clean fresh water.

I am assuming that you are only talking about dropping the leg, and doing the thermostat and checking the water pressure valve?

It sounded like you were planning a total strip down of the engine, but thats not the case is it?

i would still recommend replacing the water pump housing. Have seen quite a few reports where this has been a cause of issues, and just because your pump pumps strong sometimes does not mean that the housing is not the problem. For a few $ its hardly worth arguing about.

[Solarman]

Also, i might add, it looks like you might not have enough water in the can?? If that is the cavitation plate (+ one extension in housing) that's exposed? Difficult to tell? Hard to tell exactly where water is at, but if water is not above cavitation plate, then the water pump is not submerged completely, and pump will not work properly.

Good luck.

[mike.floutier]

Thanks again guys, this is all so helpful, not to mention encouraging.

I removed all the water pipes today to check for any blockages but they were all squeaky clean.

However the thermostat was another story, it was encrusted with gunk and appeared to be stuck in a partially open position. Also, the view inside, after removal looked much the same, ie. Gunky.

Next time I'll be re-dropping the lower unit to check if I've got the water tube properly fitted into the impeller unit outlet.

Also I'll try the vinegar routine, just trying to find a good vinegar supply locally.

Thanks for the links to the parts site exploded views, today I thought I'd be able to locate the Water Pressure Valve from these pics but I couldn't be sure so I gave up at this stage which was a pity as, if it is stuck open with gunk like the thermostat, this could also be reducing the available pressure.

Will report back after my next attempt some time next week, good thing is that I have around 10 weeks before I go back in the water.

Thanks again!

[Hoosmatroos]

Look here to see a good set up to flush your engine. When you warm up the vinegar then it works even better. Remove your thermostat before flushing.

http://www.suzukioutboardforum.com/f...8914#post38914

[mike.floutier]

Thanks Hoosmatroos, I've found a good source for vinegar so I'll have a go asap.

[mike.floutier]

As I mentioned, I'm also struggling to find the actual location of the Water Pressure Valve. The diagram in the link gives its approximate location schematically but there are so many bolts in this general area and I'm concerned about removing the wrong one and doing damage.

Any help with this would be very welcome.