DF50a 2012 no power/tone at key

[Theswayze]

Hi guys, I just joined this forum! I’ve owned my outboard since new and have serviced it myself for the last 6 or 7 years. A weird problem started suddenly one day and I’m hoping someone might be able to help as it’s got me, the dealer and Suzuki NZ baffled. When I turn the key to the on position, most of the time there is no power or tone. It’s dead. However, if I press the trim and tilt button on the remote or the engine, I get the tone instantly and the motor will then fire. I’ve replaced battery switch, new battery, new trim module, tested the ignition switch, tested main relay, fuses etc.
I’m starting to think it’s the ECM, but I’m told they are bullet proof. What else could possibly cause this weird problem?

cheers!

[Moonlighter]

Have a read through this thread, I suspect thats where the answer is

https://www.suzukioutboardforum.com/...-power-failure

[Theswayze]

Thanks Moonlighter. I’d already read that thread with interest, but I’ve sort of concluded my problem is a bit different due to the fact that power at the key on position is restored when the trim button is operated. There could be a short o suppose in the wiring loom and maybe it is something to do with a white wire somewhere. I think what I should do is go to a friends house who had a 2011 DF60a so the ECM will fit. I’ll swap and experiment to see if I get the tone or not and vice Versa. Bloody frustrating. Motor had done about 900 hours and is very well looked after. Thanks again

[Pbodsw]

I think what I should do is go to a friends house who had a 2011 DF60a so the ECM will fit.

It will fit and run but will throw a 4-1 error and not rev beyond 3K. How did you end up with the issue?

[artdf175]

From memory- the white wire splits at the key with one side feeding the ECM and the other feeding the trim/tilt switch.
When both sides don't work the white wire has a bad connection someplace before it gets to the key switch.
Since the tilt/trim works, I think you might try checking the wiring on the remote and find the split connection.
take the remote apart to get to the wiring for the tilt/trim and white wire that feeds the key.
I would not think this is a ECM issue
Art

after reviewing the white wire sticky-- check the neutral switch at the remote.. if that is going bad or out of adjustment there will be no power to the key switch

[Theswayze]

Hi guys, apologies. The e mail alerts were going o to my junk box. The problem suddenly happened when i got home from fishing one day, the tone wasn’t on the key-dead. Then I discovered the the trim button trick.

I’ve looked inside the remote box, but I think I’ll have another look at the white wire and neutral switch. I still intend to swap out the ECU to see if I get the tone on the key…
many thanks guys

[artdf175]

I had one more thought -- the natural switch on the motor ?
I don't remember the wiring diagram if that has to be correct before the ECM is powered--
I just found a wiring diagram for the df90-140 models
the white wire feeds to key switch
The neutral wire comes out of the key switch on a brown wire
the brown feeds into the ECM
this also splits preECM to the motor neutral switch
The other thing I see is the ECM main relay
my df175 fuse box has two relays that are identical
if yours has two try switching them or borrow one from your friend before taking all the time to swap the ECM's

The PTT switch is on the same leg coming off the 30amp fuse that feeds the main ECM relay and also the white wire to the key switch
there is the possibility that triggering thePTT switch kicks a bad contact in the ECM relay

Still looks like a wiring problem not your ECM
good luck
Art

one more thing (you need a manual for he schematics)
key on check voltage terminal 30
-no: ECM failure
yes: check terminal 2 - no: would be emergency stop switch failure

[artdf175]

sorry voltage at terminal 30 - no- ecm relay failure
(not ECM)

[Theswayze]

Thanks so much for the suggestions! I’ve actually swapped over the two relays and I’ve also bench tested them with a 12v supply and they work ok. Getting to remove the ECM is easy, the starboard side of the engine casing needs to come off. The left side can stay in place on my motor. It only takes 2 minutes, then you have complete access to the ECM plugs, just unplug and remove. I’ve also poked around before with a multi meter and mono power is fed to the plug on the ECM unless I hit the PTT switch from what I remember.

I’m now battling with a faulty starter motor
/solenoid. I’ve removed the starter yesterday and dismantled it. It all looks good, but when I tested the plunger/solenoid there was no continuity. I have the service manual which helps. I only just fixed the trim motor recently with a stuck brush. Crikey. What else can happen!?

[Theswayze]

Hi guys, just a quick update for anyone interested. I took my boat to a friends house who has a DF60a 2011 and we swapped the ECU’S to see what happened. Now don’t forget, I never get the tone on the key unless I hit the trim button on the remote or engine. When I put my ECU on his motor, we got the tone no problem. When I put his ECU on my motor, no tone! This to me is conclusive proof that my ECU is ok. Thank the lord! So now, I’m looking at relays, white wire, pinched cable, electrical short, corrosion, ignition key, remote etc.

my new after market starter motor is arriving from the UK. Being a small market here in NZ, this was the best option. I’m honestly thinking of repowering once it’s all done. If I can’t solve the tone thing, maybe the dealer will still trade in on a new motor. I certainly can’t sell it like this. Boats and motors are fetching top dollar here. Boat dealers hardly have any boats on display as they are all sold! Second hand rigs are going for big money as the lead times on new builds is 18 months plus.
cheers guys.

[artdf175]

one thing that came up on another post is the ground wire.
just one more thing to track down.

[Theswayze]

Thank you. It’s bloody hot at the moment and doing this sort of stuff drives you nuts!

[Theswayze]

So I finally have the answer! A wire (black with blue stripe) on the engine loom had work away, well the outside did. Eventually the inner conducting wire had broken/separated. It was found at the last minute by the dealer at the rear left of the motor. He unwound some tape and it was immediately obvious. After cutting it out and rejoining, I had the tone and it started! I just about shed a tear!

[Moonlighter]

Perhaps there was some previous damage to that wiring that someone had done a poor job of fixing and just covered with tape?

[Theswayze]

Nah. I’ve had this motor since new! Maybe it left the factory like it? A ticking time bomb anyway. I spent over a year trying to find the cause of the problem and a lot of money too. It was like someone had shaved the outer layer off the wire on one side with a Stanley knife. I can’t seem to up load a pic due to file size too big. The dealer was saying he was pretty sure it was the loom, it would be 2500 bucks ex Japan as he said or would take so long to look at all the wires on the loom. Then a minute later he unravelled the tape to expose the damaged wire. WTF!