Replacing old MFD with Chartplotter

[JYAK..]

I have a pair of 2012 Suzuki df150’s with a single 34200-87L11 MFD.I was hoping to update my system with a pair of Smg4 gauges or Smd 7 MFD,having just been told that my engines are not compatible,I started looking at a pair of C10 gauges which I think would work,but I’m having no luck in finding them here in the UK,plus a pair is quite expensive,so I was just wondering what is the best chartplotter I could use instead which would show all the engine date including engine warning alarms

[Moonlighter]

I dont know what that part number 34200-87L11 is because its no longer listed when I searched.

Is it the old SMIS 4” gauge that is basically a Lowrance LMF400? Round 4” monochrome digital gauge? If you google LMF400 you will see what they look like.

If not, can you describe it by model rather than part number??

Sorry you are out of luck with getting a large screen MFD (Multi Function Display) that will show all engine data plus fault codes etc from a 2012 model year engine. Doesn’t exist. If the engines were 2016 or newer then yes, but you would need new interface cables as well. Going to be expensive.

SMG4 is compatible with most 2013 model and newer engines. 2015 and newer for all engines.

If your current gauge is actually a SMIS 4” digital display (eg LMF400), the simplest, easiest and best option is the C-10 displays, as they will show it all and are a direct swap, fits in the same hole, just unplug the SMIS and plug in a C-10 (one C-10 can display data from 2 engines) Or, add a extra T to the network backbone if you want one C-10 for each engine. A bit of configuring once its installed, but pretty straightforward. Google a Simrad IS-35, the C-10 is 99% the same so a IS-35 user manual will be a useful download.

C-10 are and have only ever been available in the USA for some reason, you would need to buy from a US vendor and have them sent over.

[JYAK..]

suzuki gauge.jpgThank you Moonlighter,i've just bought the boat and it came with this gauge single gauge,i've never seen one like this before,i can get hold of the Simard IS-35 easily in the UK,would a pair work with the engines,im guessing i would need to buy some wiring so i can split the harness

[Moonlighter]

I have never seen that gauge before, it must be a European special model. I therefore do not know how it works. I am just guessing, but perhaps its an older Simrad gauge that’s been customised for Suzuki….

You have to understand that the various gauge systems are fundamentally different in how they work. SMIS, C-10 are NMEA2000 displays that will only talk to the engines through a NMEA2000 network and they need a Suzuki engine interface cable cor each engine to convert the J1939 raw data from the engines into NMEA2000 format and to do the fuel management stuff.

SMG4 connects directly to each engine harness the same way as an analogue gauge. You need one SMG4 for each engine. They dont use the interface cables because the gauges themselves do the data conversion to NMEA2000. They can be connected to a NMEA2000 network but really only need that so they can receive speed data from the GPS which enables the gauges to calculate fuel economy. But if you don’t want to do that, SMG4 can happily work without being connected to a NMEA2000 network at all.

So as I said, I dont know what your current gauge is or how it works.

You need to get behind the dash and have a look at the gauge connection and harness.

If that gauge is connected to a NMEA2000 backbone, it will be plugged into a T piece in the backbone. (If you google search for NMEA2000 backbone you will see photos and diagrams of what they look like)

If that is the case, then have a look at the other T pieces in the backbone and follow the wires to see what else is connected to them. Lets assume your boat does have such a backbone, it would then have one T piece for the gauge to connect to, two more for the Suzuki interface cables, and one for network power. So a row of 4 backbones. Maybe one more if there is a GPS puck antenna being used to supply speed data to the network. So possibly 5 T’s in the backbone all up.

If there are 2 x Suzuki interface cables connected to the backbone, then we will be safe to say that the gauge is a NMEA2000 gauge and replacing it with one or more C-10’s will work.

You could also go into the gauge menu and look for a network device list, make sure the engine keys are turned to “on” where it beeps, but dont need to start the engines. Usually there is a system menu or settings menu, and the network menu is in there, and the device list the next level down. There should be 2 x Suzuki devices appear in the device list, one for each engine. If you open each of them you should see the details there including the software version of each interface. Take a photo of that page and post it back.

As far as Simrad IS-35 is concerned, when they customised the Simrad IS-35 for Suzuki, the main change they made to the software was to enable it to read and display the Suzuki fault codes and service reminders. So IS-35 cannot do that. So it is not a suitable replacement for what you currently have because it doesn’t do the full job required.

Check all that out, take photos of what you find behind the dash and in the network device list etc, and post back again.

[JYAK..]

Thank you very much Moonlighter,you certainly know your stuff,i have taken the gauge off and yes it is part of the NMEA2000 setup,so hopefully i be able to rig something up, my other thought was to fit a chartploter showing all my engine data, but think i'll have the same problem regarding engine warning alarms,i'll look into the menu and send some photos next time im on the boat

[Moonlighter]

Yes the same problem arises with chartplotters or other displays that run off the engine interfaces - not showing the fault codes.

There is a special version of the interface cables available called the Engine Connect Gateway (for Navico) displays, but it only works with 2016 and newer engines. With one of these connected to the Port engine, it enables the fault and service codes from both engines to display on selected Simrad and Lowrance displays.

I am thinking that importing a C-10 is likely to be your best option. Subject to confirming the engines are connected by the same interface cables used elsewhere in the world, which seems likely.

[JYAK..]

Suzuki wiring.jpgSuzuki software.jpg From the photos you should get a good idea of the wiring setup,If i decide to keep this MFD so i can still get my warning codes in case of an engine problem,could a plug a pair of Simard IS35's into the backbone so i can have rpm's info from both engines,saves me flicking through the menu everytime.but you are right as in a pair of C10's would solve everything,but they do say from 2013 engines,but i know smis gauges work because i use to have a 2012 df300 so i think C10 should be ok except they are big dollars for a pair imported

[Moonlighter]

I am not seeing a NMEA2000 backbone there….

But if there is, you could definitely keep that gauge so you still get the codes etc, and add IS-35’s to the network. Just add 2 x T’s to the network backbone to connect then to.

They will show everything that is output by the engine.

But I am now doubtful that the gauge you have is connected via NMEA2000.

see attached photo that shows components of a NMEA2000 backbone for Suzuki. The line of black T’s below the Garmin gauge is what you really need to see.

4363407E-CBFB-42D4-B1EB-2A91175B04A2.jpeg

[Moonlighter]

Here is a video on NMEA2000 networks to show you what to look for

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U4jAxINtF5w

[JYAK..]

Suzuki MFD.jpgBackbone.jpgYou should be able to see the backbone tucked inside which the MFD is connected too,if i went down the C10 route,would i need a interface cable fitted somewhere so the gauge knows which engine is which,or would it be like my current MFD as it shows info for both engines on one display

[Moonlighter]

To be sure what is going on there, you need to get clear access to that network backbone and see what is connected to it.

As I said I am not at all familiar with that gauge. So dont know how it works. It may or may not need a interface cable to work.

What I can say to you is how a C-10 would work in a boat set up like yours.

First, there would be two engine interfaces cables connected to the network backbone. One for each engine.

The backbone would most likely have a total of 4 or 5 T pieces, which would have the interfaces connected to 2, the gauge connected to 1, power connected to 1, and if there was a 5th T, it would more than likely be connected to a GPS puck type of antenna.

That would be a pretty standard setup for us in the rest of the world when using the Suzuki interface cable based system and a C-10 or equivalent gauge. The gauge would receive data from both engines via the network and would be able to display both engines data.

So I recommend that you get a close look at that network backbone and see how many T’s it has, and find out what things are plugged into each T. In most cases, there is usually a small silver tag on each cable not too far from the plug that connects to the T that has some kind of identification on it to help you figure out what it is for.

That will give us some greater certainty about what you have and about whether or not a simple swap from that gauge to a C-10 is feasible and/or if just adding an IS-35 will work.

I guess the alternative is to talk to your local Suzuki dealer, and armed with the info I outlined above about how Suzuki gauhpges work elsewhere, find out from them about how that specific gauge works.

Let us know how you go.

[JYAK..]

Backbone.jpg I've gain access to the backbone,i've got the MFD,chartplotter and the power source connected to it,so as you said,hopefully i can just connect two interface cables and two C10's inline,if i get that far i'll call my local dealer to set everything up including fuel readings,i think we have covered everything,thank you so much for your help,i feel like i know what im talking about now,looks like im going to have to bite the bullet and order these C10's from the US

[Moonlighter]

With just 3 network T’s, there cannot be Suzuki engine interface cables currently installed.

It seems likely that the current gauge operates in a similar fashion to the Suzuki SMG4 gauge (for 2013 and newer engines), which is connected directly to the engines and then probably/possibly outputs engine data data to the NMEA2000 network.

This means that if you want to take that display out, and want to change over to C-10’s, you will be up for the cost of 2 x Suzuki engine interface cables PLUS the cost of the C-10’s. In total its going to add up to a fairly large sum.

You could just keep the existing gauge, and try adding an extra T to your network backbone and connecting it to a compatible chartplotter or a Simrad IS-35 and see what engine data is available. The unknown for me is what data your current gauge outputs to the network. Maybe your dealer can tell you that info?