2016 Suzuki df150 - powerhead removal question

[supagruv]

Hello everyone! We're removing the powerhead to free up the driveshaft (splines seized). I've removed intake, linkage, various fuel hoses/wires/etc so nothing is still connected between powerhead and engine holder. I've also removed the bolts holding the powerhead to the engine holder (both sets from above and below). The manual talks about removing the flywheel, cylinder head cover, and a bunch more electrical stuff... but it really doesn't look like we should need to. Can anyone please help clarify things? Would really like to keep things as simple as possible. Thanks in advance!

If you're curious about more details... we're a solid week in trying to change impeller... lol. Bought twin 2016 motors 6 months back for a good price and lower hours. Did a full tune-up and everything seemed nice and clean until I went to change the impeller on the second outboard and it wouldn't come out after using shims, then a puller, then a slide-hammer... still nothing, not even 1/4 inch. At that point it because truly apparent that the driveshaft splines are stuck... We finally cut off lower unit with a sawzall and then used twin 6 ton bottle jacks and welded a plate to the drive shaft to fabricate a custom puller... still nothing. After talking to many "experts" and friends, etc... seems we gotta pull the powerhead to see if heat and lubrication can get the driveshaft out. Fingers crossed. What a saga.

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[supagruv]

Well after a handful of hours of careful deliberation and the like... we were able to get the powerhead off successfully.

The manual states that the flywheel (and related parts), the rectifier, cylinder head cover, coils, starter, and ECM all need to be removed... they do NOT.

For anyone's future reference, most of the things we removed (intake, fuel vapor separator, various hoses, wires, sensors) are just to gain access to the bolts/nuts that hold the powerhead onto the engine holder.

Now we still have the get the drive shaft splines to release from the powerhead... at this point we're thinking to weld on an eye hook to the cut piece of shaft and hang it upside down and spray penetrant into the splines and hope it works over the course of a week. Here's a few photos of our progress to-date:

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[briscoe]

No don't cut the shaft. Bad joo joo. Way too much work created now in lower unit. Probably 1000$ to repair.
take penentrent and spray splines. Buy one of the MAP gas hand held torches. It has an igniter and is similar to butane hand held torch. They have the yellow canister. Warm up the shaft at the top just below the splines. Spray more penetrant. I have heard some used diesel to work into seized part. The object is to get it to break away. If you cut the shaft, you still have to remove it. Take a pair locking pliers and grab an area of the shaft where you can hammer down on it to drive the shaft out. Back and forth warm up the shaft and spray PB Blaster up into the sized part. It might take a day to break away. Give it some time. Heat and spray and let it sit. After warming and spraying, now hit the locking pliers with the hammer a few times. Let it cool off and then do it again a few hours later. If it doesn't come off, wait till the next day giving it time to break loose. The penentrent will work.

[briscoe]

Every hit upward on the pliers. If you can get it to move a small amount you will expedite removal. Give this a try a few days. You have nothing to lose wasting a few days. $500 a day, think about that!

[supagruv]

Hey briscoe! As per my initial posts... we tried EVERYTHING for 3 days even with a welder/fabricator's help... before cutting the shaft. Thankfully we have a parts motor so we can use the lower unit from that once we get the drive shaft out.

Now that the powerhead is upside down I've been using MAP gas and various penetrants every few hours trying to get it to budge... but nothing yet. You said "Every hit upwards on the pliers"... I'm guessing you meant "Even hit upwards on the pliers"... so instead of trying to pull, try pushing the drive shaft in farther to see if that will help break it away? We tried that the other day, but not since we removed the power head.

I'm concerned too much heat could damage other internals around the shaft... but I guess that's our best option... other than cutting the shaft flush and drilling it out with a bunch of cobalt drill bits (last resort).

When we finally got the impeller out it because quite clear that it was probably years since they dropped the lower unit (maybe never???). Pretty sad that someone would neglect a newer motor like this. I reached out to the folks the sold us the motors and they gave us some vague story that they keep all their motors maintained (but we could see marks where they had tried to pry the lower unit off before).

Anyway... back to the grind. Thanks again for the help!

[briscoe]

Yes, I was meaning drive it up and then down. The object of the heat is to get the penetrant to penetrate. Heat also breaks up the calcification. By heat I'm meaning 200F, don't get it too hot. 200F is where its too hot to keep your finger on it refex takes over.. 150F is where you can't keep in contact. Don't get it glowing hot. There is a video on YouTube where they use Aero Kroil penetrant. They swear it penetrates better. They are working on a large OB.

At any rate, looking at your photo, the splines are showing on the drive shaft. You should be able to drive it up a little and then down some. Half the splined area is exposed. Up and down should work it out. It's like a frozen bolt, if you get it started go in and out. Back and forth. Don't make me come up there and do this for. Jk

[supagruv]

BTW, no splines are showing... the last thing you see before the shaft enters the powerhead is a series of horizontal lines.

I've been trying heat and various penetrants... trying not to use anything too aggressive that might get into the internal parts though. No luck as of yet.. not even a millimeter.

Will keep y'all updated if we make progress.

[briscoe]

***. And, yes taking care on the heat. It has a seal, which is below the bearing.
Did you try and turn it upside down? If you have a tire (without rim) you could lay it on top and may help with penetrant.

[supagruv]

Yeah it was hanging upside down for a day and a half now... with penetrants and heat intermittently... and pounding a small sledge upwards mostly (but some downwards strokes too for good measure). Still no sign of movement unfortunately. It's now resting on some padded wooden blocking.

We have an appointment with the Suzuki repair shop in town on Monday but at $120/hr we're trying to do as much as possible before that clock starts ticking... last we spoke he said in the end it may take the acetylene torch and then figuring out how much peripheral damage was caused and replacing parts (sigh).

[briscoe]

This is above the engine holder. There are not any seals there. My mistake. The shaft splines go directly into the power head drive gear, which is run by timing chain. You can see the timing chain, right?
Yikes. I do t know why it's not coming out. That's mucked up. Flip it over brother and soak it good. It has to come out.

[supagruv]

Yes, exactly you can see the timing chain and all gears. Wasn't sure if there was a seal there but hitting the shaft too hard doesn't seem wise either considering it's connected to all those gears. Here's the latest photo of what we're working with. Note: I welded a big steel bar (with eye-hook) on the end of the shaft so I can hang it (and bang on it as needed).

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[briscoe]

Ok, ok. New plan. You are stuck inside the drive gear. You want to warm up the collar where the splines are stuck. Keep the shaft cool. The gear collar will expand and shaft should come out.

[supagruv]

That sounds like it should work to me... but do you think heating up that collar would weaken it too much? Fingers crossed...

[briscoe]

No not at all on weakening. You have to get the steel nearly a thousand degrees to change the crystalline structure of the molecules. Just heat it evenly. I did not realize where you were before, with the engine holder removed. By "warming several hundred degrees" you will expand the collar and it should take on Penetrant more readily. It has to break loose.

[briscoe]

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This is where you are in the bottom of that gear. You will have to tear the engine down, break apart the Block and push off bearings if this doesn't come off.