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NMEA 2000 Issues...Moonlighter can you help?

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  • NMEA 2000 Issues...Moonlighter can you help?

    First off, I'm so glad I found this forum!

    Moonlighter….I read the bellow thread day before yesterday and you really helped me understand how it all works (almost). Especially the Terminating Resistor. Thank you so much!
    https://www.suzukioutboardforum.com/...n-with-key-off

    This may have been addressed already on another thread if so, please point me in the direction to that thread. I did a quick search but couldn't find anything. Here’s my problem followed by my questions:

    I have a 218 Sea Pro 228 with a 175 Suzuki that I purchased new in April of 2019. It has about 160 hours on it
    .
    About mid to late summer last year I started intermittently losing the engine information on my C-10 gauge. It varied, a few times it worked at the beginning of the trip then I’d lose it later in the day. Another time I didn’t have it in the morning, but it started working later in the day. I have a Simrad Go9 as well and I’d lose the engine info on that as well. I would however have the speed on the C10 from the Go9 so I know they we’re talking to each other. I thought it might be some sort of connection issue due to the corrosion under the console because Sea Pro did not seal anything on the console (the C10 did have a gasket), every wash job early on soaked all the wiring under the console. I got sick at the end of 2019 and the boat sat for months. I didn’t realize what was going on until after I recovered. I have it sealed up now, but a lot of damage was done. I’ve removed all the NMEA cables checking for corrosion but there is none. Anyway, on to where I am now…before one of our very last trips last year I bought a T for the NMEA 2000, was thinking one of them maybe bad. I ran out of time prior to the trip to troubleshoot so the plan was to take it with me and replace it once we were on the water. We got on the water no communication of course. Before I replaced the T’s one by one I disconnected two in-feeds one was the interface cable and the other was the fluid level cable…I put the interface cable where fluid level cable was but did not plug the fluid level cable in and I got nothing. I kind of panicked and put the cables back where they originally were…presto everything was working. I’m like, it must have been a bad connection. Ran the boat two days at the end of the second day I lost communication. About two weeks later I’m at a gas station fueling the boat, I turn the key on and it’s communicating. Get to the ramp, put the boat in, no communication. Nothing since. It’s the start of our fishing/boating season for us and I want to get this resolved. After reading the above-mentioned thread. I un-zip tied almost everything under the console night before last just to look at everything to ensure I wasn’t missing anything. I tried the new T in every location, checked any connection I could find even on the motor…nothing stuck out. I reread the thread again yesterday and double checked the interface cable connections under the console as well as checking the connection at the motor. I could not find anything…I’m an electro/mechanical technician by trade, but this has not helped me with this troubleshooting…LOL

    My questions:
    • What in the Heck is going on?? LOL
    • Does my Simrad get the engine info from the C10 or does it get it from the engine?
    • How do I determine if it’s a motor issue or a connection issue? The nearest Sea Pro dealer is 50 miles away, I have a Suzuki tech in my area.
    Thanks in advance!

    PS: It was scary not being able to see the temperature of the motor...I was concerned if for whatever reason the motor started to overheat I wouldn't know. Is there any other protection when the communication is lost? Is there an overheat alarm on the motor?
    Last edited by Seapro22818; 03-05-2021, 09:44 AM.

  • #2
    One more thing...I just realized that the Fluid Level Sensor cable comes from the tank. I don't think it's ever been configured because I don't recall seeing it on the Device list in the C10. I'll double check when I get home.

    Now that I know the Fluid Level Senor cable isn't associated with the engine interface cable, I'm now thinking the interface cable maybe bad, can the cables slowly fail like this or is it a dead stop fail? Thanks!

    Comment


    • #3
      Ok.

      All of the engine information comes from the engine interface cable. The data gets sent from the interface cable to the network, and then any compatible display on the network can read and display it. So C-10 and GO both get data indirectly from the Interface.

      There IS an update to the engine interface cable software that fixed data dropping out, so the first thing to do is to check what version yours is currently running. I can send you a link to the new version to upload if required. Checking the current version is easy - as follows:

      Turn engine key ON so the gauges turn on. Engine doesn’t need to be running.

      Turn Simrad GO display on. Then in the menu, select

      Settings/network/device list. Scroll down to the Suzuki device that should be listed. Open it, or select Configure, and you will see a new screen pop up with details including software version.

      Report back with what the software version says. The key details are the first numbers which should be version 3.5.0 or 3.5.04.


      Re the fluid level sensor, it doesnt need to be configured to be listed on the device list, it just needs to have have the power wires connected. I suspect that there is a broken wire on the tank sender unit or the power wires are damaged, so check and rectify at that end first.

      Comment


      • #4
        Even if the gauges are not working, you will still get warnings from the buzzer in the throttle control binnacle. The engine ecu will still put it into safe node or reduce rpms etc if it overheats.

        Comment


        • #5
          Thank you so much for the reply!

          I can’t see the Simrad in the device list, only the C10 Color Gauge is displayed. I made sure everything was powered on and tried the Auto Select button. It didn’t find the Simrad. The Suzuki logo is gone from the Simrad as well.

          I looked at the diagnostics page. “Bus on”, 128 “Tx Errors”, 1 “** Message” were the only things listed.

          I also checked the wiring for the fuel tank sending unit. I cut the connectors under the console (sending unit to the Suzuki Fluid Level cable) I ohm’d the wires going to the sending unit and got 125 ohms across the two, I have no idea what that means though.

          Not sure where to go from here.

          Thank you

          Comment


          • #6
            Forgot to add..,I did not see the Suzuki in the Simrad settings.
            Last edited by Seapro22818; 03-06-2021, 12:21 PM.

            Comment


            • #7
              Just found on the web that this sending unit will read 33 ohms at full level and 240 ohms empty so I have a little less than a half a tank and the wiring must be good?

              Comment


              • #8
                Lets leave the fluid level sensor for later. Its the least of the problems.

                If the C-10 and the Simrad each only see themselves on their device lists but nothing else, then it is possible that the network is not being powered on. Check the power connections and the fuse and fuse holder in the + wire. If the network is powered on, all devices that are turned on should appear on all of their device lists. (Make sure the battery is fully charged too). If they dont, then the possibilities are:

                - a bad T piece somewhere in the backbone that is not allowing data through
                - network is not terminated correctly - must have a terminating resistor at the ends.
                - devices are plugged into the cross part of the T instead of the leg. Devices MUST be plugged into the leg of the T’s only.
                - the devices have failed ( eg if you see all other devices except the Suzuki then the interface cable may have failed. If they get water into the black module then that will kill them. Have a look at where the wires enter the black module so see any signs of water entry or corrosion there.
                - is there any unknown device showing on the device lists? Even one that is just listed as dashes?

                Comment


                • #9
                  Ok, I’m definitely getting voltage, batteries are charged. I moved the devices around on the bus, and now on the C10 device list I see the Simrad and the Fluid Level Sensor but no engine info. I’m going to purchase another T and one by one replace the Ts.

                  I went into the settings of the Simrad but didn’t see the Suzuki on the device list. I do see the Suzuki logo on the main page though.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    You could also try one of those multi-T’s that take 4 devices.

                    It would be unusual for an interface cable to fail after only a year or two but it is possible.

                    The reason that I asked if there is any unidentified device showing on the device list is because sometimes the interface software gets corrupted, and in that case reloading the software can bring it back to life.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Try putting the interface cable on a known good T. it sounds like ypu have now got both the displays on good T’s as they are both seeing each other on the network.

                      Then check device lists again, remember engine key has to be turned on.

                      And make 100% sure that there are terminating resistors on each end of the network!!
                      Last edited by Moonlighter; 03-08-2021, 02:05 AM.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I actually did this yesterday evening. I took out all but three Ts, I had power in from engine, the C10, and the Simrad. The two end Ts had the terminating resistors. The center T was a new one, this where I had the Simrad plugged into. I turned on the key, the Simrad showed on the C10 device list. I turned the key off, removed the Simrad cable and plugged in the Suzuki interface cable, turned the key back on. I did not see the engine on the C10.

                        I’m going to replace the interface cable...the module may have had some water intrusion from where the console leaked, who knows.

                        I’ll order one this morning and report back when I get the cable.

                        Thank you so much for your time!

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          One more question...I'm seeing different part numbers. I just called my local dealer they tell me the part number is 990C0-88149-357. Online I see 990C0-88149-354 (3.5V)...the one in my boat has 3.5.0 on the module. I saw a picture of one online with 3.5.4 on the module. Which one do I need? Thanks!

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            357 is the latest version. So I would get that one.

                            350 was the original 3.5 version. 3.5.4 and now 3.5.7 are tweaked to make improvements and fix issues.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Great, picking up the cable Thursday, I’ll report back.

                              Thank you again!

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