DF70 Bogging/Stalling

[ghannan98]

Hi All - Appreciate all ideas on this. I'm trying to troubleshoot a nasty problem on a 1999 Evinrude 70 HP Four which I understand to be same as DF70 (open to someone telling me I'm off on that, if I'm wrong). The basic symptoms I have are difficulty with initial cold start and difficulty maintaining a good idle. If i'm able to start and run the engine, it seems to do ok under 3000 rpm (according to tach, see below for intrigue on that), but any abrupt change in throttle leads to bogging/hesitation. Sometimes, if I stay in it, the bogging will clear, but lately the bogging will actually shut down the motor. the motor will restart, usually with no codes (beeps).

I have replaced VST , confirmed clean fuel, see 5psi from low pressure pump and steady 35psi from high, battery is new I have warm , but not hot water from telltale.

I purchased the SDS software and cables from ebay and installed and hooked up for a test at the dock. This is when it gets strange.

I will post the Service Data below , but my first observation was the Tach was off by approx. 500rpm compared to what displayed on the laptop. The idle was approx. 800 according to laptop but was showing 1500 on the tach, which I understand to be high but, adjustable via a known procedure. In looking at the service data below, what I see is a motor (or an ECU?) with 59 hours on it, but I have two cautions in the data that were at 93 hours and one at 44.

Is that even possible? I figure once I know the diagnostic data is reliable, we can start figuring out what to do about it.

Thanks for any ideas.

Save date 12/4/2016
Comment
Engine No. 1-
Boat Type bw nausett
Description first look 12/4/2016
Engine information
Power 70PS
ECM ID 33920-99E12
Spec. ---
Engine Type 4 stroke 1298cc
SERVICE DATA
Item Data Unit
ENGINE SPEED 0 rpm
IGNITION TIMING BTDC 6 °
MANIFOLD ABSOLUTE PRESSURE 753 mmHg
MANIFOLD ABSOLUTE PRESSURE 100.4 kPa
MANIFOLD ABSOLUTE PRESSURE 29.68 inHg
BAROMETRIC PRESSURE 735 mmHg
BAROMETRIC PRESSURE 97.9 kPa
BAROMETRIC PRESSURE 28.95 inHg
CYLINDER TEMPERATURE 10 °C
CYLINDER TEMPERATURE 49 °F
INTAKE AIR TEMPERATURE 11 °C
INTAKE AIR TEMPERATURE 52 °F
BATTERY VOLTAGE 12.23 V
FUEL INJ. PULSE WIDTH 0 µs
INJECTED FUEL AMOUNT 0 mcc
FUEL PUMP DUTY 0 %
IAC VALVE DUTY 0 %
NO. OF MAP SENSOR FAILURE 0 times
NO. OF CKP SENSOR FAILURE 5 times
NO. OF IAC VALVE FAILURE 2 times
NO. OF CMP SENSOR FAILURE 1 times
NO. OF CTP SWITCH FAILURE 0 times
NO. OF CYL. TEMP. SNSR FAILURE 2 times
NO. OF IAT SENSOR FAILURE 4 times
NO. OF EX. TEMP. SNSR FAILURE 0 times
NO. OF FUEL INJECTOR FAILURE 255 times
NO. OF OVER-REVOLUTION 0 times
NO. OF LOW BATTERY VOLTAGE 0 times
NO. OF LOW OIL PRESSURE 4 times
NO. OF OVERHEAT(GRADIENT) 5 times
NO. OF OVERHEAT(TEMP.) 1 times
CAUTION SYSTEM NAME (1) Low oil press
ENGINE SPEED (1) 5563 rpm
MANIFOLD ABSOLUTE PRESSURE (1) 623 mmHg
MANIFOLD ABSOLUTE PRESSURE (1) 83.1 kPa
MANIFOLD ABSOLUTE PRESSURE (1) 24.56 inHg
CYLINDER TEMPERATURE (1) 38 °C
CYLINDER TEMPERATURE (1) 101 °F
INTAKE AIR TEMPERATURE (1) 35 °C
INTAKE AIR TEMPERATURE (1) 96 °F
EX-MANI TEMPERATURE (1) 196 °C
EX-MANI TEMPERATURE (1) 385 °F
FAILURE TIME (1) 93 h
ELAPSE OF TIME (1) 0 min
CAUTION SYSTEM NAME (2) Overheat grad.
ENGINE SPEED (2) 1156 rpm
MANIFOLD ABSOLUTE PRESSURE (2) 241 mmHg
MANIFOLD ABSOLUTE PRESSURE (2) 32.2 kPa
MANIFOLD ABSOLUTE PRESSURE (2) 9.5 inHg
CYLINDER TEMPERATURE (2) 26 °C
CYLINDER TEMPERATURE (2) 79 °F
INTAKE AIR TEMPERATURE (2) 14 °C
INTAKE AIR TEMPERATURE (2) 58 °F
EX-MANI TEMPERATURE (2) 196 °C
EX-MANI TEMPERATURE (2) 385 °F
FAILURE TIME (2) 44 h
ELAPSE OF TIME (2) 0 min
CAUTION SYSTEM NAME (3) Low oil press
ENGINE SPEED (3) 5500 rpm
MANIFOLD ABSOLUTE PRESSURE (3) 583 mmHg
MANIFOLD ABSOLUTE PRESSURE (3) 77.7 kPa
MANIFOLD ABSOLUTE PRESSURE (3) 22.96 inHg
CYLINDER TEMPERATURE (3) 38 °C
CYLINDER TEMPERATURE (3) 101 °F
INTAKE AIR TEMPERATURE (3) 35 °C
INTAKE AIR TEMPERATURE (3) 96 °F
EX-MANI TEMPERATURE (3) 196 °C
EX-MANI TEMPERATURE (3) 385 °F
FAILURE TIME (3) 93 h
ELAPSE OF TIME (3) 0 min
TOTAL OPERATION TIME (HRS.) 59 h
TOTAL OPERATION TIME (MIN.) 56 min
0-1000 RPM 50 min
1000-2000 RPM 1678 min
2000-3000 RPM 1028 min
3000-4000 RPM 602 min
4000-5000 RPM 216 min
ABOVE 5000 RPM 22 min
ELAPSE TIME FROM REMINDER CANCEL 65535 h
NO. OF OIL CHANGE REMINDER 255 times
COMPENSATION FACTOR (ZONE 1) 1
COMPENSATION FACTOR (ZONE 2) 1
COMPENSATION FACTOR (ZONE 3) 1
TIME OF LAST O2 FEEDBACK 0 h
EMERGENCY STOP SWITCH OFF
CTP SWITCH ON
NEUTRAL SWITCH ON

[ghannan98]

Solved

Hi all - for the benefit of anyone experiencing this. Change your plugs first. Mine were severely carbon fouled. As soon as I did this, I could get it to idle and then try to make the change to the IAC screw to get it to idle between 600 and 700. it was still a little rough. using the Suzuki software, I ran the fuel injector cut off test. based on that I determined , I had some severely clogged injectors. Ran two 5 gallon tanks of Premium fuel each with 5 oz of seafoam and that appeared to fix it. Spent probably 15 hours troubleshooting all the sensors, which , though educational, was unnecessary. hope this helps anyone with similar problem.

[hale448]

I am having similar issues with my df60. It idles and runs great until I get it to 3800 rpm. It acts like it goes into a limp mode until I back off on the throttle. All the sensors appear to be fine. It has me stumped. Thanks for sharing.

[ghannan98]

change the plugs

Try the plugs first. spent hours messing with sensors that turned out to be good. This is what my plugs looked like. Once you change the plugs then , I had clogged injectors to deal with. Would suggest you get the SDS software and run the injector cut off test. The thing I observed was that I could cut off three of the injectors (one at a time), and the engine still could idle, but one of them , when I cut it off would cause it to die. From that I concluded only one injector was giving good supply. You could take the injectors out, and get them cleaned. I just ran two 5 gal tanks of new fuel with seafoam, re-ran the cut off test, and observed that I could now cut off the one good/clean injector and the other injectors were flowing enough fuel. It was a glorious moment to have gotten to the bottom of this. Good luck.

[BigNige]

I have a similar problem with my DF50 (Circa 2007). 6 months ago it was lumpy, unreliable often would choke at about 4500rpm sometimes getting through it and sometimes dying. Been working through things with the local dealer. Replaced a bush in the float chamber (but old one was ok) checked out fuel lines, water separator, primer bulb (replaced) also spark plugs and injectors were checked but things gradually worsened until it would only run for a couple of minutes at any revs before cutting out and would require a couple of minutes stopped before it would restart again. Everything I was reading said fuel pump so they replaced that. Now it starts ok runs for 20 to 30 mins at 2/3000 rpm runs smoothly and doesn't miss a beat. At 4500rpm gets a bit lumpy at 5000rpm cuts out after 20 to 30 seconds try and push above 5k and it cuts out immediately. When it cuts out the float bowl is empty and I can get it to run longer at 5k by pumping the primer bulb continuously. No obvious temperature problems. Any Ideas anyone.

[Solarman]

Bignige, and Hale448, it is best to start your own thread rather than tagging another's thread for your problems. Each problem, though sounding similar are many times NOT identically the same problem. Post your own problems in your own thread, and many more owners will see it and pose possible solutions. Details of what you've checked and done, are very helpful to get the best results.
Hale448, I wrote this for bignige then noticed you had also commented. Please start your own thread with motor info, any history of event, and anything you've done/tried to do to correct the problem. Thanks.

Bignige,
Does sound like fuel restriction. Did they clean the low and high pressure filters AND the float-bowl needle valve seat (Often if fuel pump goes bad, particles can lodge on the backside of the needle-valve seat restricting fuel entering float bowl, acting like running out of fuel.)

There could still be an air leak on the suction side of the "new fuel pump", causing poor fuel flow.

Did they rebuild low pressure fuel pump, or replace it? If not the electric low pressure pump, if rebuilt, it might still have a problem with the internal check-valves, not provided in most rebuild kits?

Just some thoughts, post back if they find anything. Good luck.

[BigNige]

Sorry Solarman but I can't see how to start a new thread so jumped on board this one as it deals with similar issues. Yes it was a brand new pump. Enlighten me on how to start a new thread and I will re-post. Many Thanks

[Solarman]

On the first page of this forum there is a red "new thread" button at the top and bottom of the page. Once you select new thread, put your motor info and problem in subject line (briefly), then be very detailed in symptoms and efforts made, or tried. You can include pics in the lower section, if they will help solve your problems. The more helpful you can be with your situation, the easier it will be for those of us on this side of the screen to visualize your problem.

Once posted, all readers view your situation. Every post is important, and there are many around the world that will read your post, be patient.

Good luck, post back when able to let us know how it's going.

[ghannan98]

Put Guage on Fuel Rail

Hi - Realize this may get moved , but in case not, would suggest 2 things - 1- Get the SDS Software and Cable - run the engine with all this connected and log the data (this would help show if its a sensor ) 2-Put a fuel pressure gauge on the fuel rail, what I think you would expect to see is between 35 and 40 PSI , when you start to bog at 5K see if your pressure is dropping, this will at least confirm that you are loosing pressure to the injectors. also put a gauge on the outlet side of low pressure , again look for a drop when you see the problem. good luck.