Buy Suzuki Outboard Parts

Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Need an expert - 1998 DT 140 EFI will only idle in guardian mode.

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Need an expert - 1998 DT 140 EFI will only idle in guardian mode.

    Engine starts up fine cold, If I were to put it in the water, it will start up for the first time of the day and I can take off and run on plane all day. If I drop back to idle it will slowly die out in a manner that seems like its flooding. At that point it will not restart until it has sat for an hour or 3. I can keep it running by lifting the throttle up and keeping it above 1k rpm while in neutral.

    So I first unplugged the TVS (throttle position) sensor and it idles fine! This puts the engine in guardian mode and I can see the error for TVS flashing, but it will sit there and idle in the yard fine. When I plug that back in it loads right up within 30 seconds and dies out. I bought a new TVS and put it on and it does the same exact thing.

    Other things I have checked.
    Cylinder temp sensor works fine when I check resistance while heating it in water
    Air temp sensor works fine when I checked resistance while heating it.
    Barometric pressure (map) sensor tests at 4.97v I thought this was it as the manual I have (found on these forums) says 3.65v I bought a new map sensor and that new one reads 4.97V as well!!! I really thought I had it figured out if the pressure sensor was enriching the fuel too much, but my two sensors read the same voltage
    Checked the fuel pump by pulling it off and pumping the ball, no fuel comes out of the vacuum port so that should be ok
    I have tons of fuel pressure when I pulled a hose off past the fuel pressure regulator ( I did this while on the water to get it restarted once, just to remove fuel from the engine then it would start)

    As I am typing this could that pressure regular be a issue? I was thinking it was electronic because in guardian mode it idles fine. My next thought is could it be the main ECU? I hate to buy a new one (used ebay is even 300$ or so)

    Edit: There are no check engine codes flashing. I also checked compression, all between 100 - 95. Engine idled fine when I first got it and ran it in January with it very cold outside (also made me think sensors) I also made my own test cable and checked voltage on my TVS as I open the throttle and it does change like I would expect.

    I bought the real suzuki manual and waiting for that to arrive as well just to see if that tells me the map sensor voltage is different than the aftermarket .pdf manual I got off of this site.

    Need help from any experts on here, i've been fighting this one for a month now. Thanks in advance.
    Last edited by Krabill; 06-22-2020, 07:03 AM.

  • #2
    Any ideas at all?

    Comment


    • #3
      It might be too much pressure on the injectors? Possibly the fuel pressure regulator is not reducing the pressure enough? Have you run a pressure test, to see what the pressure is on the fuel rail?

      Still have not heard of a MAP sensor on a 2 stroke motor? Where is it located?

      Good luck, post back on what you find out.

      Comment


      • #4
        The MAP sensor is located near (above) the throttle body, just above where the air temp sensor is located. Attached s a picture of the sensor.

        I just bought a fuel pressure test kit, I will test the rail to see what pressure it is holding and report back.

        s-l1600 (1).jpg

        Comment


        • #5
          Tested fuel pressure this morning per the manual. After the regular it showed 37 PSI when I turned the key on and off a few times. Manual says 36.3 so that seems fine to me. It held that pressure as well when I started it and it idled for 30 seconds or so before it started to die out, pressure did not change as it slowly died out. I then pulled the pressure regulator and did the air pressure check on it and just like the manual said it released at 36 PSI and I could see the poofs of air come out. so that tests ok.

          Still will idle fine if I make it go into fail safe mode, as soon as I take it out of that it will die out at idle like its flooding up.

          Comment


          • #6
            I think you need to go through the TVS inspection and adjustment section of the manual. Somehow, it sounds like an adjustment or voltage problem.

            You might be able to find a 4 -pin connector test cord by googling the part number and item name?

            I think it's still too soon to say it's the ECU.

            Good luck. Post back on what you find out.

            Comment


            • #7
              I was thinking the same thing, so I ordered a used used throttle body with the TVS sensor still attached to it. That came in last night and I put that on this morning. The TVS still has the painted marks over the screws from where it was factory set. I figured this would be my best shot at ruling out that I have the TVS adjusted incorrectly. I swapped that one out this morning and it did the exact same thing, died right out after idling for 30 seconds or so. I can unplug the TVS on this one and it goes into guardian mode and idles fine. Needless to say I was kinda sad The dern motor runs great when going fast and it has low hours. I really dont want to spend the $500 bucks for a used ECU on ebay just to find out its something else. I feel like I have gone through almost every possible thing in the manual. I might replace the air temp sensor and cylinder temp sensor even though the resistance tests good on both just because its a cheap part on ebay.

              This engine is really making me learn a lot but its winning the battle at the moment. Feel free to throw out any suggestions.

              Thanks

              Comment


              • #8
                Did you test the TVS power supply (V1). What did you get for that reading? Do you have the connector to read the voltage supply? This test is first in the trouble charts.

                Good luck. Post back on what you find.

                Comment


                • #9
                  TVS V1 voltage looks in spec to me.

                  I also pulled all the injectors and verified each one clicks, they look clean but gave them a hydrosonic bath anyhow.

                  Now to add to my problem, once I swapped the new throttlebody with TVS on it, it will now not idle even in guardian mode with the TVS unplugged. So, I will put my old one back on to see if it will go back to the original problem of only idling correct when in guardian mode, if it does not I can start looking elsewhere, like maybe a busted reed?
                  Attached Files

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Well, I pulled the throttle body off to swap and stuck in an inspection mirror just to peek at the set of reeds in front of it. Sure enough there was a cracked reed. So I went ahead and ripped the entire intake off and found a number of chipped reeds. I had the same problem with my Optimax motors a year ago! I just ordered a set of Boysen aftermarket reeds to replace all these. HOPEFULLY this is why she wouldnt idle and the guardian mode thing was somehow throwing me off. I will report back next week when I get the aftermarket reeds installed.

                    Attached Files

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Just a followup. I put all new Boysen reeds on the reed cages and put everything back together and she starts up and idles great now!! did 20 miles on a test run yesterday!

                      Thanks for the help, maybe this thread will help someone in the future.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Krabill,
                        Can you help me out on the type of Boyesen reeds you installed please?
                        They list several kinds and it would really help if you have part number of reeds you purchased

                        I have the same systems and think I will go ahead and do a teardown to eliminate the reeds.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          here is the ebay link i bought

                          it just says "Reed Kit, Boyesen Suzuki DT115/140"

                          https://www.ebay.com/itm/272697255825#viTabs_0

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Roger that
                            Did you replace all associated gaskets as well?
                            You have helped me alot--- Thank you!
                            I was just about to give up on this motor

                            Comment

                            Working...
                            X