DT225 Lower Units Stuck

[SirIzzy]

Happened to me... see my post on THT about the fix....
https://www.thehulltruth.com/boating...self-save.html

Good luck.

I read over the posts and am contemplating putting a 2 or 3 inch hole in the casing which I should be able to close up with a plug. If I decide to try this, I will test it on some aluminum sheet first, but I am wondering ... If I put a hole in the upper casing, would I then be able to spray some juice up into the spline to help dissolve any corrosion? If so, where do you think this hole needs to be?
Also, looking over the parts diagrams it looks like the inside of the casing is all open. Is that correct, is it all just directing exaust and water back down the leg?
Another also ... again looking at the parts diagrams it appears the shaft is all the way toward the bow side of the leg, so the hole should likely be on one of the angled facets of leg. At least that's what I'm thinking.

[Moonlighter]

Guys, just a heads up to highlight an important distinction that needs to be borne in mind here:

The OP here has a DT 2 stroke Suzuki model.

Several replies to him are talking about stuck drive shafts on larger hp DF 4 stroke Suzukis, and they have the offset driveshafts which the 2 strokes do not have, so the whole connections of the drive shafts to the driven gear are completely different beasts.

It seems more likely that his problem is therefore a more traditional stuck lower unit due to corrosion in the connecting bolts and locating pins, especially since he has mentioned that the heads of several gearbox bolts were broken off when trying to remove them.

[briscoe]

Touche. Thought he was working on DF140 or 150. I don't think an external water pump would work even if he had the best work shop ever.
Srlzzy, you need to pull off the power head aND remove the top to get to the bottom.

[SirIzzy]

Touche. Thought he was working on DF140 or 150. I don't think an external water pump would work even if he had the best work shop ever.
Srlzzy, you need to pull off the power head aND remove the top to get to the bottom.

If I remove the power head, then we will know it is not the shaft that is corroded at the spline and holding up the works.
Assuming the power head lifts off, then do you think I will be able to push down on the shaft to get the lower unit to drop or will I then need to continue disassembly working my way down? My concern is any bolts I need to remove below the power head are also going to be corroded and difficult to remove. Nevertheless, I suppose its either start at the top and work my way down, or throw in the towel.

[Moonlighter]

What is wrong with the suggestions from several experienced members of having a machine shop look at the broken off gearbox fixing bolts and see if they can get them out?

[SirIzzy]

What is wrong with the suggestions from several experienced members of having a machine shop look at the broken off gearbox fixing bolts and see if they can get them out?

Nothing wrong with the suggestion except that I cannot move the boat at this time. It is currently on blocks in my yard next to my garage. Shopping for a proper trailer is on the todo list. I have been asking around to see if I can get a machinist type person to come out but have not found someone yet.

[Solarman]

A boat sitting on blocks, with twin engines, and straps pulling one of the lower units with a vehicle, and come-along is a goodly amount of pressure (Sounds like a disaster waiting to happen?). And I'm guessing you have used a bit of penetrating lube around the entire lower seam, bolts, pins and all. Plus, using a little heat to get penetrating lube to soak up around those broken bolts, and pins, and then using a hammer on a good block of wood to shock the cone section downward, and with all this, you still haven't been able to get a little separation for any putty knives, or wedges. (I have never had a lower unit stuck this tight.) Then yes, gaskets, and maybe more broken bolts, being the biggest problem, the powerhead may have to come off?

I'm not sure these motors, or the boat are of much value, if they've been sitting up that long?

Good luck, post back on what happens.

[SirIzzy]

A boat sitting on blocks, with twin engines, and straps pulling one of the lower units with a vehicle, and come-along is a goodly amount of pressure (Sounds like a disaster waiting to happen?). And I'm guessing you have used a bit of penetrating lube around the entire lower seam, bolts, pins and all. Plus, using a little heat to get penetrating lube to soak up around those broken bolts, and pins, and then using a hammer on a good block of wood to shock the cone section downward, and with all this, you still haven't been able to get a little separation for any putty knives, or wedges. (I have never had a lower unit stuck this tight.) Then yes, gaskets, and maybe more broken bolts, being the biggest problem, the powerhead may have to come off?

I'm not sure these motors, or the boat are of much value, if they've been sitting up that long?

Good luck, post back on what happens.

Hey, are you the guy that's been standing across the road watching me this whole time?
You summarized my situation perfectly.

I got the boat with motors for next to nothing. I'm trying to salvage all of it... If I can. The boat is sound but needs plenty of TLC. The motors fire up and appear to run good but need impellers replaced. That's were I'm at and still trying.

I appreciate any and all suggestions.

Thanks,
-Izzy

[SirIzzy]

An update in case anyone is interested. At this point my plan is to remove the powerhead and see where that goes.

Yesterday I was able to pickup an inexpensive complete "parts" motor. First thing I checked before agreeing to adopt this parts motor was remove the lower unit bolts. They came out easily so I now have at least another right hand lower unit that I can use or swap parts. I have no idea of the internal conditions of either the powerhead or lower, but I'll be taking it all apart anyway. With this in mind, my plan is to remove the powerhead on my starboard motor (normal rotation), work my way down, and use pieces off the parts motor as needed to put it all back together. If this works then I suppose I'll try and do the same for the port motor. Will let you all know my progress when I make some. With a bit O luck, it will all come together and in the process I should learn all about how the big Suzuki two stroke works and is put together.

[SirIzzy]

I have now disassembled the "Parts" motor and removed the power head. Having done this, I don't see that lifting the power head on my motors with the stuck lower units is going to help me any if indeed it is the flanges and alignment pins that are stuck due to corrosion. Or is the reason for doing this is just to prove that the shaft is not stuck on the splines?

[Solarman]

It just eliminates the splines as being the reason for the lowers not coming off.

Good luck, post back on what you find out.

[SirIzzy]

I worked on the port motor today and got the lower unit off! I did wind up damaging the mid section and the cavitation fin, but I believe I can braze the pieces back on and repair them.

Having disassembled the "Parts Motor" and since the lower unit came off easily I could see that there is NOT a flange, just two mating surfaces and two alignment pins. So the only things that could be holding the lower unit on are the two alignment pins and the shaft splines. Since I had already damaged the cavitation fin by hitting it hard ... in my defense it was a dead blow plastic hammer, but I learned today you can break things even with a dead blow hammer ... anyway, since I had already done some damage to the lower unit I figured why not try to "make" some separation. I first used a couple of small chisels on the rear of the lower unit and made a small gap which allowed me to use increasingly larger chisels until I was able to fit the blade of a maul. I wailed away at the maul wedge until I could fit another wedge into the mid section. I continued to wail away at the mid section and the rear for what must have been a few hours and FINALLY the shaft released and the lower unit dropped! So I'm left with needing to make some repairs to the cavitation fin and mid section where it meets the lower unit. However, the mid section damage doesn't concern me much because that whole area is flooded with water when in the water anyway. Nevertheless I will attempt to repair the broken bits and/or use the "Parts Motor" lower unit.

I will think about it some and try not to do so much damage when I go to to town on the starboard motor.

One other thing I'd like to mention. In my earlier post I stated that all but one bolt head sheared off. So I had 4 studs to remove now. I got them out using an old mechanics trick that has always worked. I heat up the studs and briefly heat up the casing where the studs are screwed into, then quickly apply candle wax which melts and gets sucked up int the threads. While still hot, I grab the stud with vice grips or an extractor and wiggle it a little ... and they all wiggled now (that's the magic of the wax) ... and they all backed out easily! I then clean out the holes, put a liberal amount of grease on a bolt and run it up/down each hole. I'll use more grease when I do the final assembly.

[Curtlj]

I had the stuck lower end problem myself. The key is to go at it slowly. Do not use wedges. The corrosion around the bolts is the problem. This corrosion must be loosened for the bottom end to drop. After trying every liquid corrosion breaker on the market no luck. Then I read about the 50/50 mix of acetone and transmission fluid. I began to heat up the area where the lower end meets the top and spraying the 50/50 mixture into the meeting point of the bottom end and top where the bolts are. Heat and repeat. Heat and repeat. You wont get it done in one day. The acetone pulls and pushes the trans fluid into the crevices between the bolt studs and holes they are in. The corrosion/salt etc will SLOWLY start to break down. Next carefully beat the shit out of cavitation plate. It took 4-5 sessions on different days of this process. The key is not to rush it and walk away from it frequently. Also apply heat and the 50/50 mixture to where the studs snapped off and the acetone will pull it up into the holes. Patience grasshopper.
PS I have dual 90A motors hanging on my rig also, so I had to do this twice. Good luck, you'll get it.

[SirIzzy]

I got the starboard lower unit off today. Again, a little damage to the mid section, but nothing that in my opinion cant be fixed with aluminum epoxy. I did use wedges as in my case the motor(s) were definitely stuck at the drive shaft. Once again, I started with a small 1/4 inch chisel, worked my way up to a 4 inch chisel, used some wooden and plastic wedges, and kept at it until I could get my maul in there. Once I had the maul in there then she really started to open up but slowly. The trick to using a wedge is it needs to be near the bolt holes there the casing is strongest. In any event I got this lower unit down in about an hour.

So for me, the tools required to perform this impeller service include but is not limited to ... 1/4 to 4 inch chisels, two large mauls or axes, 2 lb sledge, 3 lb sledge, wooden and plastic wedges, a ratcheting strap, steel or brass hole cleaners, Acetone, Starbrite Aluminum Putty Stick, lots of grease (I use marine grease on all the bolts going in), all the usual hand tools (sockets, wrenches, screw drivers, plers, etc.), a power impact wrench (to loosen the prop nut), oh and an impeller service kit of course (2 in my case) ... and a victory beer once the lower unit actually dropped!

Also, In case anyone is wondering, I left the controls in neutral for both motors, and I use a ratcheting strap to catch the lower unit and let me lower it slowly once it lets go. I also use the ratcheting strap to lift the lower unit up until I have a few bolts started. I have done this many times with my other motors (80 & 90 hp Mercs) and it makes it much easier. I also built a lower unit stand with a Harbor Freight moving dolly and a few scrap 2x4's from the Lowes scrap heap.

Thank you all again for the suggestions and help! Very much appreciate it. If I figure out how to post pics, I'll put some up.
-Izzy

[Solarman]

Glad to hear the success. You can take any piece that broke off, and the lower units, or entire boat once off the blocks, to a machine shop, they can repair those damaged parts properly with aluminum welding (heliarc), they'll grind the welds smooth. Then just a little paint, and all is good.

Good luck, post back on the how the motors run.