DT225 No Spark

[turbojoe78]

My engine has run great for years (98 DT225). First time out this year it ran great till I was trying to get on the loading dock at the end of the day. Waiting for someone to move off the dock, I was doing slow circles at around 900 rpm's and the motor stopped and would not re-start. Stopped like I had shut off the ignition, no chugging or sputtering at all. Tried quite a few times to get it going but no luck, it turned over very fast but did not give any sign of firing. The next day when I went to check it, it started up the second time I turned it over (first time it almost caught and the starter kicked out) and ran fine for about 10 minutes and I shut it down. The next time I tried to use it, it turned over fast with out trying to start 3 or 4 times before it finally started and seemed to be running fine. After I backed it off the trailer, and was slowly backing down the dock, it shut down just like the first time, no stuttering, just stopped running like I shut it off. I was able to get it running again after trying quite a few times and when it finally caught it smoked a lot, like it had been getting gas all the times I tried to start it but was getting no spark. I let it run for another 5 minutes at the dock and it ran fine till I started to back off the dock. I got about 1 foot back and it stopped again. I tried to start it again when I got it home to flush it out and it would not start. I checked today and found I have no spark. I have a Suzuki manual to help trouble shoot and am reaching out to those who know much more than me about outboards on where to start. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Joe C

[Solarman]

Do you have a Suzuki manual for your motor?
I would recommend checking the gear counting coil by the manual. Also, make sure the wires from the magneto are not damaged or grounding out. First, make sure the kill switch is not causing your problems.

Once you have checked the kill-switch, then the magneto wires and thier connectors, then go to the gear counting coil, also if the proper distance to flywheel.

Post back on what you find. Good luck.

[turbojoe78]

Do you have a Suzuki manual for your motor?
I would recommend checking the gear counting coil by the manual. Also, make sure the wires from the magneto are not damaged or grounding out. First, make sure the kill switch is not causing your problems.

Once you have checked the kill-switch, then the magneto wires and thier connectors, then go to the gear counting coil, also if the proper distance to flywheel.

Post back on what you find. Good luck.

Solarman, thanks for your reply. I do have a Suzuki manual ... I don't have a kill switch so I'll go to the magneto wires and connectors and follow the rest of your suggestions. I'll report back as to what I find.

Thanks for your help!

[turbojoe78]

Sorry for taking so long to get back. I checked the magneto wires and all looked ok, I also ohm'ed out the pulser coils and the counter coil and they all checked out at 222 to 224 ohm's.

It looks to me like I now need to check input and output voltages for the CDI. Would this be the next step? Do I need the 4 pin connector the manual mentions, and also a peak voltage meter?

[Solarman]

Are you getting spark to any plugs? Have you tested both sides of each spark plug coil, and checked plugs?

Have you checked the ground connections, many times poor grounds cause sporadic problems.

Did you check the ohms on the magneto's "high condenser charge" coil, and the ohms of the "low condenser charge" coil, by the book?

The "low condenser charge coil" is the one for low speed (starting, and charging the CDI)?

The gear counting coil and Throttle Positon Sensor and pulse coils control the timing, related to the positon of the flywheel, and throttle.

Have you tested the Rectifier-Regulator, by book? This provides the battery DC power going into the magneto, and converts the voltage to AC voltage coming out of the R/R.

Is this motor EFI, or have carburetors? Have you checked the fuses?

Then, if all checked out good, move to testing the CDI. The output voltage signal to each plug coil is the most important. Are you getting output voltage to each coil? Have you checked ground connections to CDI and coils?

Good luck, post back on what you find out.

[turbojoe78]

Are you getting spark to any plugs? Have you tested both sides of each spark plug coil, and checked plugs?

Have you checked the ground connections, many times poor grounds cause sporadic problems.

Did you check the ohms on the magneto's "high condenser charge" coil, and the ohms of the "low condenser charge" coil, by the book?

The "low condenser charge coil" is the one for low speed (starting, and charging the CDI)?

The gear counting coil and Throttle Positon Sensor and pulse coils control the timing, related to the positon of the flywheel, and throttle.

Have you tested the Rectifier-Regulator, by book? This provides the battery DC power going into the magneto, and converts the voltage to AC voltage coming out of the R/R.

Is this motor EFI, or have carburetors? Have you checked the fuses?

Then, if all checked out good, move to testing the CDI. The output voltage signal to each plug coil is the most important. Are you getting output voltage to each coil? Have you checked ground connections to CDI and coils?

Good luck, post back on what you find out.

I've only checked what I listed so far, and removed and cleaned the Neg cable that bolts to the starter and the ground wires on the PTT up relay because I saw some green corrosion on them..
I'll remove and clean all the ground connections I can see listed in the manual, and remove all the plugs and check all the plug wires for spark. So far I only checked the 3 plug wires on the right side of the right bank of cylinders. I'm also looking to get a Stevens CD-77 max voltage meter and a 4 pin connector harness to check voltages to and from the CDI. I'll let you know what I find out.

[turbojoe78]

In between the rain, I removed all the ground points, cleaned them with sandpaper and re-installed them. (2 on the starter, 1 on either side of the cylinders, 1 behind the upper coil on the right and the 1 behind the wiring below the starter) I also confirmed that there is no spark at all 12 plug wires.

Tomorrow I'll ohm out the high and low condenser charge coil and check the Rectifier-Regulator. I did also check the fuses and the motor is EFI.

[turbojoe78]

Found 2 more ground points where wiring comes in on lower shroud and cleaned them. Found and ohm'ed condenser charge coil and got no reading on the high or low side. I could only get a reading if I set the meter to check for continuity, and then I got readings of 1.597 and 1.589. I also found the three yellow wires for the regulator/rectifier and I could not get any reading from them, either to each other, or to ground.
Electrical stuff is my weak point so I may be doing it wrong, but I was able to get readings on the pulser coils and counting coil with the meter set at 2K

[racso65]

hey joe did you find the no spark problem on your motor ?? I am having the same problem everything checks out but not the rectifier, but what will the rectifier have to do with , there being no spark?

[Solarman]

I will go back, do you have a suzuki service manual for your motor?
This is a must, because each Suzuki motor has its own numbers for ohms that are good and bad. Likewise, it explains how to test each item I've asked you to test.

Yes the rectifier/regulator is important. Your magneto produces a/c voltage, your r/r converters it to dc voltage-regulated to charge batt, and helps to power other areas of your motor.

Re-read through the electrical section for the tests i suggested for your motor, if the manual isn't for your motor, you need to get the correct numbers (or pic of that page in the manual with numbers) from someone that has the correct manual for your motor.

Your flywheel is a key component for making your motor run. You might need to remove it to inspect the magnets, and crankshaft key. DO NOT THREAD THE FLYWHEEL PULLER BOLTS TO DEEP, they will damage your magneto if too deep (measure threads bolts go into, then only put them in that deep, no farther!).

Good luck, post back on what you have.

[racso65]

I will go back, do you have a suzuki service manual for your motor?
This is a must, because each Suzuki motor has its own numbers for ohms that are good and bad. Likewise, it explains how to test each item I've asked you to test.

Yes the rectifier/regulator is important. Your magneto produces a/c voltage, your r/r converters it to dc voltage-regulated to charge batt, and helps to power other areas of your motor.

Re-read through the electrical section for the tests i suggested for your motor, if the manual isn't for your motor, you need to get the correct numbers (or pic of that page in the manual with numbers) from someone that has the correct manual for your motor.

Your flywheel is a key component for making your motor run. You might need to remove it to inspect the magnets, and crankshaft key. DO NOT THREAD THE FLYWHEEL PULLER BOLTS TO DEEP, they will damage your magneto if too deep (measure threads bolts go into, then only put them in that deep, no farther!).

Good luck, post back on what you have.

I have an original suzuki manual it says is a 1986 but the serial on my motor, i can not find anywhere I know is close to the year because is a 15001-602603 but the last six numbers i have not been able to identified, any ways my results where: all of the coils checked out within spects , but IC power source fails both ohms and volts when checked, rectifiers I dont get nothing ,I dont get any readings on the CDI unit but because of previous finds I dont want to rule it out . I have to go back to remove the wheel and checked the magnets and coils, ill post back

[Solarman]

Well to start with "15001" says the motor is a dt150. And the 602603 could be a 1986 dt150. So compare all your findings to the DT150 motor in your manual, and see what is different.

Good luck, post back on what you find.

[turbojoe78]

My last post was right before I went on vacation for 2 weeks. This is what has happened since then.

Since I was stuck where I was, I brought my boat to a marina I found listed as a Suzuki dealer on their website. I gave the shop a printed run down of the history of the boat, what happened when it died and wouldn't start any longer and what I had done for trouble shooting to that point. I got a call from them later in the week telling me that all I had done was correct (even though it was not) and that they had re-checked all I had done and it was all good. They then ran max voltage tests on it and deemed it to have a bad CDI unit, which they told me showed as NLA. (no longer available) They told me they couldn't do anything more for me because they couldn't get the CDI. I hung up the phone and went on line and ordered a new CDI from Boats.net and got it the next week. I brought the boat home and installed the new CDI last Saturday only to find my self with the same no spark issue. I went to the marina to talk to them about it last Monday and was told the mechanic wouldn't be in till Wednesday.

When I got home I decided to look at it again to see if I might have missed something. When I was looking I noticed that the wires I had checked to ohm out the cond. charge coils had been the ones on the CDI side of the connector, that's why I didn't get any readings from them when I checked them originally. I decided to check them on the correct side of the connector and went looking for the Xerox copies of the service manual I had put in the boat before bringing it to the marina. When I looked through the copies, I also found an additional one that the shop had left in with mine. Their page was from a service manual for a 86 DT150/175/200TC motor which only shows 1 charge coil to test with the readings being from 180-260 (G-B/R). On the back of the copy he wrote G-B/R 83.1 which according to the front would have been below spec for the reading on the front.

In the manual it says to set the DVM to 20* and shows specs as Condenser charge coils 62-92 Green - Black/Red, 384-575 White/Red - White/Blue. My meters lowest setting is 200, at that setting I got 86.5 G-B/R and no reading on the W/R - W/B. When I switched the meter to the next setting (2K) I got a reading of .599 on the W/R - W/B. I also got readings on the battery charge coils with the meter at 200 of 0.5 on all three yellow wires. The manual says the reading should be 0.28 - 0.42.

I went to the shop on Wednesday after work and was told the mechanic was on an off site call. I explained what I think happened with the shop trouble shooting it as an 86 (the boat is an 86) and the motor being a 98 and pointed out that maybe that was why they believed the CDI to be NLA. The mechanic was supposed to call me when he got back to the shop, I have not heard from anyone yet.

So now I have a brand new CDI ($389) and an invoice for 2.5 hours of labor ($312.50) and still have no spark! It looks to me like I need a stator due to the reading on the W/R - W/B wires showing a .599 reading at the 2K setting on the meter.

Any thoughts on this would be great. Joe C

[Solarman]

Well, the serial number you gave earlier says it is a 1986, dt150, and I'm not too sure, but if it is a CDI for a 98, don't think I'd use it, if it is an 86.

Good luck.

[racso65]

hey joe. I read in another post that they got their no spark problem solved by changing the low oil warning unit. hopefully thats the problem. I am having the same problem with my motor witch is already making a hole in my pockets so i am going to try tomorrow ill let you know