Who here is running analogue gauges plus interface to MFD?

[Moonlighter]

Hello - I am inquiring about setting up both Analog and Digital. I currently have a 2008 250ss that is linked to Faria analog gauges, and additionally I have a HDS7, GPS, and Suzuki 2' gauge connected to a NMEA 2000 network (installed when the boat was purchased in 2009). Hoping to link the engine into the network, but the dealer was not able to (or maybe didn't know how) back when the boat was originally purchased in 2009. I imagine the NMEA network cables are correct versions for the 2008 engine since they were purchased back when the boat was built in 2009. I see there may be a way to have both connections using a 'adapter' cable. Could someone shed a bit more light on how I might go about this. MANY thanks in advance for helping finalize a 10-year project.

Which Suzuki 2” gauge do you have? Analogue or digital? If its digital the connection will be easy. If analogue it will be more difficult.

If you upload a photo of you dash showing gauges it would help to see what you have.

[MOwatersports]

Thanks for the quick response. The 2" gauge is the digital. Again the engine connections are currently to the analog, and not the 2" nor the HDS7. Here is a pic of the console: the HDS7 is on the lower right hand (mostly out of sight) with the 2'' located on the top right hand. This was the only pic I had as the boat is 3 hrs away. Thanks

[Moonlighter]

So you are saying that the 2” digital gauge is connected to a N2K network, but not connected to the engine?? What is the 2” gauge currently used for then??

If that is the case, then to connect the engine to the network, you will need

- a Suzuki engine interface cable, probably running V2.9.0 software.
- a reverse K8 adapter cable - this cable allows the interface cable to be connected to the round SDS plug on the engine. Just double check that the SDS plug on your engine is round, as they changed in 2008 from round to square. If its square you need a standard SDS adapter cable instead of the reverse model.

I also recommend that whichever adaoter cable you need, that you cut it in half and extend its length so its long enough to reach from the engine up to the dash area, where it can then be connecetd to the interface cable.

NOW, a couple of issues you will need to address.

1. Back in 2008, the N2K network connectors used by Lowrance/Suzuki were not industry standard - they were larger blue/grey ones. So check and see what colour your existing network T’s are. You might need to buy an adapter cable to enable the engine interface and new gauges to be connected to the old network.

2. Its a crap shoot as to whether the current interface cable V2.9.0 will work properly with your engine. The earlier engines used a different software design than the current ones, and the old cables that definitely WILL work with your engine are rarely available now. The older cables that run V2.5.0 software will work, but almost impossible to find one.

So the bottom line is - do you take the risk of buying a V2.9.0 interface cable and hope it all works?

[MOwatersports]

Moonlighter - thanks for the quick response once again. To be clear both the HDS unit and the 2" digital gauge were installed time of purchase back in 2009, along with the gps and N2K network. Since the dealer was unable to get both digital and analog to work in tandem (known after purchase), I only had the HDS connected to the gps and the 2" digital being left obsolete, and running the engine off to the anologs. I will check and see which model(s) of both the N2K network connectors are (larger blue/grey or other) and which engine SDS plug I have (square or round).

1) With that being said, I know you mentioned issues with compatibility with the 2008 engine and the SDS cable versions. To add to that, would the *older model gauges* (HDS and 2" digital Gauges purchased in 2009) require/work with the v2 9.0 cable and/or v2.5.0 cable?

2) Are you able to run trim to both analog and digital gauges?

Thanks again

[Moonlighter]

1. No problems running the HDS gen 1 and SMIS gauges with earlier engines and any version engine interface cables. You will probably just need to update the SMIS gauge software to be compatible with the V2.9.0 cable, but that can be easily done via the HDS.

In the early days, not many dealers were up to speed with the digital stuff, and were not aware of the workaround we found that enabled both anaologue and digital data to be used at the same time. Basically, this involves leavin the harness connected up as normal so the analogue gauges work, then picking up the digital data direct from the diagnostic connector plug on the engine (the SDS plug).

2. Running trim to both digital and analogue gauges is problematic. Trim data is via a 2 pin plug on the engine and currently it will be connected to your main harness connection. To get it onto the network (so it can then display on digital devices) it has to be unplugged from the harness and connected to the intrface cable which has a 2 pin connector for this purpose. So its one or the other. Some have talked about trying to jump the plug to speffectively split the trim data into 2 plugs but I dont know anyone who has done it.

Let us know hiw you go if you decide to roll the dice with a new V2.9.0 cable. If you go that way, the thing that gives away if its working properly is the fuel flow data - if the fuel flow rate at idle looks sensible, then it will be good. But if the fuel flow at idle is something like 8x or 10x what it should be, then it can never be fixed,

[MOwatersports]

Moonlighter-

Thanks for the solid advice and information. Sorry for the delay I have been away. I will try for the v2.9.0 cable and see where that gets me. Hoping to make it back down to the boat within the next month.

[Oddjob]

An experience of mine that may help others.

The setup:- 2017 Warrior 170 powered by a DF80A, adapter cable from SDS engine socket to dashboard, engine interface cable (ver 2.9) to 2K backbone "manifold" and finally to Lowrance 12 HDS Gen 2 Touch. The boat is also fitted with an analogue rev counter and TT gauge.

Originally installed electronic setup in 2017 not long after getting the boat, fired it up and all worked superbly, set up my MFD dashboard and off we went for the 2017 season - super.

Re-commissioned the boat for this season after the winter layup and off we went again. Half way through this season I was out fishing and started my run home and switched to the engine dashboard on the MFD and to my consternation all of the gauges showing engine data on the MFD were dead. The couple of gauges on the MFD dash that showed VMG and voltage were OK so my mind immediately thought that only the data from the engine had stopped so it must be a data transmission from the engine problem.

Removed the boat from the water and started some diagnostics to check data transmission lines and the 2K system power, still assuming that the problem would lie in that side of the system as the non engine parts of the dash were still working on the MFD. Managed to check the power rail on the 2K and also bought a spare 2K "T" piece to interchange it with the others but all was good. Managed to check the continuity of the adapter cable with the help of "her who must be obeyed" but all conductors were present and correct. Now we are down to the interface cable so returned it to Suz GB Customer Services who after a couple of weeks later returned it to me having tested it and found nothing wrong.

Then the light bulb moment - the MFD is a computer controlled piece of kit - so if all else fails turn it off then back on again, this happens every time I use the boat as for insurance purposes the MFD has to be removed from the boat when it is not being used, so if that doesn't work then re-configure the computer!!!! Back to the boat connect everything up, go in to the configuration pages for the engine connection, configure the setup and hey presto the dashboard re-appeared with all gauges working just fine.

I don't know what had caused the problem of loss of of configuration but if you have the same symptoms as my problem check the MFD configuration first, so that you are not pulling things to bits just to find out there is nothing wrong with them and having to re-assemble.

Happy boating, Oddjob

[Moonlighter]

An experience of mine that may help others.

The setup:- 2017 Warrior 170 powered by a DF80A, adapter cable from SDS engine socket to dashboard, engine interface cable (ver 2.9) to 2K backbone "manifold" and finally to Lowrance 12 HDS Gen 2 Touch. The boat is also fitted with an analogue rev counter and TT gauge.

Originally installed electronic setup in 2017 not long after getting the boat, fired it up and all worked superbly, set up my MFD dashboard and off we went for the 2017 season - super.

Re-commissioned the boat for this season after the winter layup and off we went again. Half way through this season I was out fishing and started my run home and switched to the engine dashboard on the MFD and to my consternation all of the gauges showing engine data on the MFD were dead. The couple of gauges on the MFD dash that showed VMG and voltage were OK so my mind immediately thought that only the data from the engine had stopped so it must be a data transmission from the engine problem.

Removed the boat from the water and started some diagnostics to check data transmission lines and the 2K system power, still assuming that the problem would lie in that side of the system as the non engine parts of the dash were still working on the MFD. Managed to check the power rail on the 2K and also bought a spare 2K "T" piece to interchange it with the others but all was good. Managed to check the continuity of the adapter cable with the help of "her who must be obeyed" but all conductors were present and correct. Now we are down to the interface cable so returned it to Suz GB Customer Services who after a couple of weeks later returned it to me having tested it and found nothing wrong.

Then the light bulb moment - the MFD is a computer controlled piece of kit - so if all else fails turn it off then back on again, this happens every time I use the boat as for insurance purposes the MFD has to be removed from the boat when it is not being used, so if that doesn't work then re-configure the computer!!!! Back to the boat connect everything up, go in to the configuration pages for the engine connection, configure the setup and hey presto the dashboard re-appeared with all gauges working just fine.

I don't know what had caused the problem of loss of of configuration but if you have the same symptoms as my problem check the MFD configuration first, so that you are not pulling things to bits just to find out there is nothing wrong with them and having to re-assemble.

Happy boating, Oddjob

Thanks for that, yes sometimes the network can lose configuration, perhaps due to a power spike.

However, is your DF80A a 2017 model the same year as the boat?

If so the likelihood is that the problem was instability of the network due to the wrong version software on the inteface cable - a 2017 engine should be running V3.5.0 software. Running V2.9.0 is known to be unstable with a 2017 engine.

Depending on the model of your cable, you can download the correct V3.5.0 version for your cable and upload it to your cable by saving the file to a suitable micro SD card (no larger than 32GB) and doing the upload via your HDS Gen 2. If you dont know how to do that come back and I can walk you thru, its very easy.

see here:

https://ww2.lowrance.com/Suzuki

[Oddjob]

The engine was brand new with the boat in March 2017 however being so early in the year I suspect the boat builder probably purchased the engine in 2016. The specific details are:- Mod No.DF80ATLK16, Ser No. 08002F-610348 so by the back half of the serial number and ref the Lowrance information you linked in your reply it should have ver 3.5. However to the cruncher - when I first bought the boat and got the interface cable I had some "debate" with Suzuki GB Cistomer Services and my supplier about them supplying old version cable. Suz GB said it would not make a difference even though I do not get all the data inputs as listed on the v3.5 spec sheet. They have now gone even further and say that v 3.5 would not work with my engine which I think could be a bunch of bull**** and certainly when I started the MFD project over a year ago it seemed that I had more knowledge than they cared to admit and certainly more than them

It would be nice to upgrade the software however in earlier communication with you, you had mentioned that the v2.9 cable was probably not upgradable. Unfortunately, at this time, I cannot easily access the interface cable for the part number as it is on the boat and the boat is at our holiday home a couple of hundred miles away. If you could possibly give me a procedure for updating and guide as to which cables can be upgraded I would certainly give this a try at next opportunity and feedback. Only proviso is that if it did not work the cable, presumably, would not upload the update and therefore remain at v2.9, if this is not the case then I would be a bit reluctant to risk the v2.9 programming.

Best regards Trevor (Oddjob)

[Moonlighter]

The engine was brand new with the boat in March 2017 however being so early in the year I suspect the boat builder probably purchased the engine in 2016. The specific details are:- Mod No.DF80ATLK16, Ser No. 08002F-610348 so by the back half of the serial number and ref the Lowrance information you linked in your reply it should have ver 3.5. However to the cruncher - when I first bought the boat and got the interface cable I had some "debate" with Suzuki GB Cistomer Services and my supplier about them supplying old version cable. Suz GB said it would not make a difference even though I do not get all the data inputs as listed on the v3.5 spec sheet. They have now gone even further and say that v 3.5 would not work with my engine which I think could be a bunch of bull**** and certainly when I started the MFD project over a year ago it seemed that I had more knowledge than they cared to admit and certainly more than them

It would be nice to upgrade the software however in earlier communication with you, you had mentioned that the v2.9 cable was probably not upgradable. Unfortunately, at this time, I cannot easily access the interface cable for the part number as it is on the boat and the boat is at our holiday home a couple of hundred miles away. If you could possibly give me a procedure for updating and guide as to which cables can be upgraded I would certainly give this a try at next opportunity and feedback. Only proviso is that if it did not work the cable, presumably, would not upload the update and therefore remain at v2.9, if this is not the case then I would be a bit reluctant to risk the v2.9 programming.

Best regards Trevor (Oddjob)

The link in my previous reply shows how to identify which model cable that you have. No guarantees, but it is more likely than not that you have a current model V2.9.0 cable running .swup software. This is because the old cables were discontinued well before your purchase date so, unless they had a very old stock cable on hand (unlikely) ....... chances are that it is a new .swup model.

Yes, you are correct that if you try to upgrade the sw on a old version cable using the .swup update file, it simply wont upload and will just freeze the upload process, I have not heard of any damage being done, you can abort the process when it freezes and V 2.9.0 will still be there.

I would say it is worth a shot updating the cable to V3.5.0 .swup version. Here is how to do it:

Go to that link in my previous reply and download the V3.5.0 .swup file and save it onto a blank SD card that will fit into your HDS (not sure if your HDS takes normal size SD or micro SD) of no larger capacity than 32GB.

Turn on the HDS, and then Insert the card into your HDS. Turn the engine key on, the engine doesnt need ro be running but the key must be turned on to where it beeps.

Then in the HDS menu, find the Files menu, and then locate the SD card, open it, and then select the V3.5.0 update file, and select upload. A progress bar will pop up showing progress. It takes a minute to upload, you will see it happening.

When it finishes, to check that it has uploaded correctly, open the network menu, device list and select the Suzuki device, open it, and you will see a page that lists the device details including the software version. It should now show as V 3.5.0.

You may want to check that boat settings such as fuel tank capacity and engine locatio and number of engines have been saved, but it should be good to go from there. Note that all fuel used related data (trip, seasonal etc( will likely have been reset to zero.

[Oddjob]

Many thanks Moonlighter - My cable definitely looks like the .swup from the pictures on your link page ie no noise filters so will give it a try and will feedback after trying update.