Suzuki new Multi Function Gauge and NMEA2000

[Kreuz1971]

Hi
I've a 2015 Suzuki 140 ATL and I want to connect the new Multi Function Gauge part no 34000-96L00. In this gauge there is a NMEA 2000 plug which I want to connect to my Lowrance HDS 12 (thru a NMEA network)

Could anyone pls. confirm that for doing the connection to the motor I need to connect the SDS connektor (4-pin square) to the mainwiring on the motor and that's it ?
I don't see any need for a interface-cable here as the NMEA 2000 signal is already at the gauge ?

Thanks for your help

Per

[Moonlighter]

The gauge will only work if it is connected to a NMEA2000 network. You are wrong thinking you dont need an interface cable.

You have to get your head around the fact that the "gauge" is in fact only a "display", and it is not connected to the engine like the old analogue gauges were. Totally different.

Everything (the engine, the display and the HDS) must all be connected to the network.

The engine must be connected to the network via a Suzuki engine interface cable. Once all these things are connected to the network, they will be able to communicate with each other and display data sourced from each other.

No network = no communication between engine and either of the displays. So new gauge wont display engine data.

Read my paper attached to the sticky thread about Suzuki NMeA 2000 networks at the top of the forum home page. Tells you what you need to know about how this system works. Diagrams etc ar there.

[Kreuz1971]

thanks for your fast reply. I have read your paper several times and its a very very good information

My theory was that it would get the NMEA 2000 signal in the main-wiring harness for this new gauge as it on the diagram seems as it has a connection directly to the square connector on the motor, where you normally connect your interface-cable

I will test it later - thanks for your reply I really appreciate it :-)

Per

[Kreuz1971]

Instalaltionmanual page 7

[mmanuel]

I see what your getting at, on my 2015 DF30A connecting the engine interface to the 4 pin on harness did not do the trick (yours might be different). I had to connect to the diagnostic port on the engine itself to get it to work. You will have to have an engine interface at some point to translate the serial data stream from the engines diagnostic into a N2K network protocol data stream.

[Kreuz1971]

Hi
after two hours working on the boat I sorted it out. The main wiring from the motor to the steering-console is prepared - the only thing you have to do is to disconnect the two black connectors and place it in the grey connector.

My gauge is now working well. I tried to connect the gauge to NMEA network and my HDS was able to "see" the gauge but it didn't know what it was. Then I disconnected the gauge and plug in the interface-cable and then it was possible for my HDS to see the Suzuki-engine in the devicelist

Do anyone have a solutions for connecting both the gauge and the interface-cable (they use the connector) ? will it be OK to make a new plug in parallel ?

The square plug on pict 2381 is the one to the gauge - the female is at the mainwiring

Per

[Moonlighter]

Add another T piece to the network, plug the gauge into that.

[Kreuz1971]

Hi,

sorry - but I need to bring this up again as it still not working.

When connecting the Multi Gauge to the 4-pin (digital output from motor) and the NMEA the Multi Gauge works very well (it turns on automatically when ignition is on) - but I need the 4-pin plug for the interface adapter as I want to connect it to my Lowrance HDS.

If I connect the interface adapter to the 4-pin plug and to my HDS it works well BUT it's not possible to turn on the Multi Gauge. I think the Multi Gauge needs a signal from motor that the ignition is on and that signal comes from the 4-pin plug

The Lowrance is not able to see/read the motor thru the NMEA 2000 - it needs the interfaceadapter

Perhaps a solution is to split the 4-pin into two 4-pins ??

Regards Per

[artdf175]

Moonlighter is our resident expert on this
But on the HDS display,with ignition key on
You should be able to find the NEMA 2000 network
Under that you should be able to find your engine
The only other thing I can think of, and I think Grant talked about this earlier
Is to make sure the cable is working with the correct software version.


Art

[Kreuz1971]

Hi Art
The problem is not the HDS - I can connect and see all data. The problem is that I cant connect both the HDS and the gauge at the same time
Per

[Kreuz1971]

Hi Art
The problem is not the HDS - I can connect and see all data. The problem is that I cant connect both the HDS and the gauge at the same time
Per

[Moonlighter]

Hi Art
The problem is not the HDS - I can connect and see all data. The problem is that I cant connect both the HDS and the gauge at the same time
Per

Per

I am waiting for further confirmation from my contacts at Suzuki, but....

I think I see what the problem is. I think that the wiring diagram you posted earlier in this thread at post #4 is intended to be used when ONLY the C10 display is being used, nothing else networked. So, as a stand-alone gauge similar to an old analogue gauge.

I think this diagram has lead you up the wrong path. Frankly, i would completely ignore it because the way it is set up is far more complicated and it means that you are not taking advantage of the C10's full capabilities.

As i say, my initial advice from my Suzuki contacts is that the C10 is set up exactly as per the connection method I outlined in my papers on the sticky thread on this forum. I don't think anyone sets it up as shown in that diagram, even Suzuki deakers! (Am just waiting some confirmation on that bit!)

If you look on the right hand side of that diagram, there is a section inside a dotted line that includes T pieces and a cable is shown connecting between the C10 and the group of T pieces. It is noted as the optional way to set up if you want to add other devices.

Can you confirm that in that diagram, the item labelled as #12 is the interface cable? I think it will be. If that is the case, then......

I think it is best to start over again, fresh, with your installation. Disconnect the C10 totally from how you've got it wired up now.

Then Create a simple NMEA2000 network and connect everything though it, then you will achieve what you want to. As per my instructions in my paper. Where diagrams show a SMIs display, simply substitute the C10.

Doing it this way will give the C10 access to GPS data (and thus be able to give you mpg and other data such as distance to empty) from the HDS connected to the network. Without access to GPS data it cant do those calculations.

It really is that simple. Both the C10 and the HDS can then share and display the engine data at the same time. The C10 will use the GPS data from the HDS in ots calculations, and the HDS will display engine data from the network.

[Moonlighter]

Ok, i can now confirm that one of the top Suzuki dealers in the US and one who I know for certain knows more about this stuff than almost any others hasnt seen that diagram or method you have used.

I also spoke to my local Suzuki guy here in Australia. He and I together worked out most of this stuff since it really got going over here from about 2010, and have continued to share info and keep ourselves at the top of the knowledge tree on this stuff. He is more expert on me than linking Garmin gear to the Suzuki's, I am more expert than him linking Suzuki to Lowrance and Simrad. He hasnt seen that diagram either.

If you call Lowrance in Australia to ask about linking your Suzuki to Lowrance via NMeA2000, they send you a paper I wrote. Fuuny, one day I called them to ask about something that had me stumped and they referred to my own paper!! I should hit them up some $ for use of intellectual property!

Anyway, both said that the method in that diagram is inconsistent with established NMEA2000 networking protocols. I.e it breaks the rule of no direct connections between devices.

Both install the networks with C10 displays exaxtly the way I have outlined in my paper, and plan to continue to do it that way.

Both agree with my recommendation that you should disconnect it, and redo the installation as per my paper. That is, with a proper, simple NMEA2000 network and have everything connected to the network.

We know it will work if done that way, because we have all set up many using that approach. We know that our way wil not damage anything.

let us know how you go.

[Kreuz1971]

Hi Grant,
first of all thanks for your great help here !
I have just returned from the boat - i connected exactly as you said. The result is that the HDS see the Suzuki-engine through the interface, but the Gauge doesn't turn on

When connecting the digital output (without the interface-cable) to the gauge it turns on as it should - but then I don't have a plug for the interface-cable which should go to the HDS. The HDS can't see the Suzuki-engine without the interface-cable it sees "something" in the devicelist (probably the gauge) but not an engine

My theory is:
The engine is originally equipped with the standard analog gauge but I made a deal with the dealer to switch to the new Multi Function Gauge when i bought the motor.
If (I think it is like that ?) you buy a new motor in 2016 it will be equipped with the new Multi Function Gauge and it will then be with pure digital with an extra digital output from the control unit to connect to a NMEA network.
As it is on my engine now I only have one digital output from the controlunit and I need two - one for the Gauge and one for the NMEA

I have asked the distributor in Denmark for the servicemanual on a 2016 to see if it is like above and if I can't see anything in that I must try to find a brandnew engine delivered with the new gauge and ask if I can make a connection to see how it works - perhaps someone in the forum has this possibility ??

Perhaps end of the story would be that I have to prioritize the Multi Gauge and don't have the NMEA connection to the HDS, but as my twinbrother is a Lowrance Prostaff member this will not be an easy task :-) ......and the information that you get on the HDS is much more detailed than on the Multi Gauge.

Per

[Moonlighter]

Hi again Per

Firstly there is no "dual" digital output issue as you have theorised. The whole point of a NMEA network is that a single input of data to the network (via the engine interface cable, for example) is able to be shared across multiple devices (eg HDA and C10 or anything else on the network).

Think of the N2K network as being like the telephone line in your house: if you have 3 phones in different rooms, they can all listen in on one call, right? Same as a computer network where if you have 1 printer on the network, 3 computers on the network can all send print items to the same printer. N2K network is similar to that.

One important thing to remember when you are setting all this up and testing it: for the HDS to "see" the Suzuki engine and the C10 device, both need to be turned on. In the case of the engine interface, the engine's key needs to be switched on, but the engine doesnt need to be actually running. Did you have them all turned on when you checked things as per your last message?

I must admit that am still a bit confused as to how your network is now set up.

When the HDS is connected to the network through its T piece, where is the C10 plugged in? Is it also connected to a network T piece? Is the engine interface also connected to a T piece too?

You see, if the HDS is getting engine data from the network, then the C10, if it is connected to the same network thru a T piece that is part of the network, then it should get power from the network through the network connection cable so it should then turn on and will also show engine data.

If that is how you have it set up there is only two things I can think of:

1. maybe the T piece for the C10 is faulty and is not connecting to the network. Can you try a different T piece in that position and see if that changes anything? Or swap it with another T piece and see if the problem follows that T piece?

2. Or, possibly, you haven't got the C10 connected correctly to that T piece. Remember, devices (C10, the HDS etc) can only be plugged into the "leg" part of a T piece. Never to the top cross part.

Otherwise, can you hand draw a diagram of the network including the C10 connection, scan it and post it up here so i can see what youve got? That will help us figure out what is going on. I will do a quick sketch of what your network should look like and post it here for you to compare.